I get so fired up when I connect with someone who wants to talk about the deeper meaning for dogs in our lives.
Like when I chat with a fellow believer that dogs teach us who we are and who we need to be.
It didn’t take long before I was mesmerized with Saro Boghozian’s words.
After becoming a certified dog trainer through The College of Canine Behavioral Science, Saro quickly recognized he also needed learn about human psychology so that he could help his two-legged clients understand the root causes of their dogs’ behavior.
Together, we explore the profound impact dogs have on our personal growth and well-being.
Where to find Saro
Angela
So back in the early days of my photography business, I had a client come to me with five beagles. And she wanted a group shot and I think I might have wanted today’s guests there with me. Good morning Sarah. How are you?
Saro
I’m doing well. How about you?
Angela
I’m good. Don’t you think that five beagles at one time sounds like kind of a nightmare.
Saro
It is a nightmare for any any dog owner any Beagle owner. I mean, I know they are considered as chips you can have only have one of many of them but five is just like all limits.
Angela
Tell me why you know so much about beagles. Well,
Saro
I started having a puppy as a beagle puppy as first dog in my life, many years ago, over 25 years ago. And it was a blessing and it was a curse in a way to I would say that all get to the blessing part. But the curse was that I had a puppy first of all, and second of all, I had a beagle puppy and that I had a beagle puppy that was not food motivated. I had to actually learn how to train this Beagle. And that motivated that kind of motivated me to learn about dogs in general learn about beagles and started being interested in becoming an educated dog trainer about dogs because I had gained so much information doing so much research about dogs and dog training, that I thought to myself, This is great. This is something that many dog owners don’t don’t get to have this information, I should share this information because I saw so many things going wrong in dog training. And the blessing was that my Beagle, Jonah, he encouraged me to become a dog trainer, I’ve changed my life, I quit my business, I quit my job. And I became a doctrine they’re fully fully committed to become a doctrine that focused on training dogs without the use of treats or food and using Play and praise. So I just diving head into dog training with beagles, and Many dog owners, they said Beagles are not trainable. But I proved them wrong. I had my biggest bully train, off leash, I could take them anywhere off leash, they were there listening and behaving normal, just like any other dog. So I wanted to become a dog trainer who could help dog owners, but also change their lives regarding the the reason and purpose of having a dog that they had in their lives. So
Angela
let’s dig into that. Yeah, why do we get dogs?
Saro
Yeah, Many dog owners, I think they don’t realize the reason why they get a dog they think, Oh, I’m getting I’m gonna get a dog, have fun with it and play with it and all that. But that’s probably you know, the first year maybe make fun and all that and then you the dog becomes part of your life, hopefully becomes part of your family member as well. And then you realize, okay, I’m more focused on this dog than anything else. And they change your life in a way because the relationship that we have with our dogs is not the same as the relationship we have with humans. It’s, it’s very deep, it’s very different. And then we realized, okay, there is a reason or purpose that there is this dog in my life. And most of us, we don’t know why they are there in there. First of all, most of the time as as a doctor and myself and a coach that I’ve worked with dog owners, within few sessions, for example, then we start digging in why this dog came to their lives and we figure out okay, this was the reason for example. So one of the common reasons, I would say is dogs, dog owners. They come in various shapes and sizes and feelings and emotions and life experiences. But most of us have gone through a trauma In our lives, and dogs are a great, I would say tool that helps us to either deal with those traumas, or figure out what to do with our lives. Using our dogs, we don’t know this until this happens until we talk about it. Until we realize, okay, there was a reason why this dog came in my life. And the reason is to help me to deal with such and such with this and that. And then that’s when I would say the eureka moment happens in our lives. And then we realized, okay, it’s not that, for example, rover was doing this and that to ruin my life. It was doing that to tell me that this is what I’m supposed to do. So I would say you like, for example, Many dog owners, they come to me and they say, I have this problem with my dog, this and this and this and that my dog does this digging, barking, growling, attacking isn’t that whatever issue it is. So we dig in, we start working with the dog owner, we figure out, it’s not just the dog is doing that to piss you off is doing it to give you signals that there is a part of your life, something needs to be addressed. And what is that part of your life that needs to be addressed? Maybe this was, there was a incident in your life that you didn’t get over it. And you’re hanging on to it. And your dog is sensing all these, and he’s giving you a message that, hey, you got to deal with this, like this, like that. And that’s when I come in. And as a doctor, I become a coach. You know, the problem is that many dog owners, they don’t want to talk about it. But once they once we have these sessions, for example, with my clients that I have, once we have these private sessions that I can be comfortable, and they can feel comfortable with me, we start talking deeper, you know, content that they never felt like it was part of their life, right? And we start digging in, we start digging in and figuring out Okay, the reason for example, rover did this was because of this. And that once they figure out what is going on day, that changes the whole perspective of dog training. Now it’s not about rover, reacting rover, being nonsense, or over being angry or aggressive or anything like that. Now, it’s about that dog owner not to change its mindset change its being so it can reflect a more positive and healthier energy to the dog. The dog is just there to give you that signal. That there’s something deeper going on in your life. And that’s the purpose of our dogs.
Angela
Is it a bad thing to train dogs with treats?
Saro
It’s not a bad thing. It’s just the limit, you limit you to train a dog who has all the emotions and senses that you have with one tool, right? It’s it’s a tool in your toolbox, but it shouldn’t be your first tool that you’re going to start using. Put and trade should be the last tool in your toolbox. First thing should be natural, natural things that a dog really loves, which is play and praise. That’s what the most purpose of a dog is to have fun play and be praised by humans. I mean, you go and tell your dog What’s your What a beautiful doggy. You just do that the dog goes crazy. Yeah, just for you. At looking at the dog I used to own a doggy daycare and we came across a lot of dogs and they were like not my dogs. They were my clients dogs but I could look at them and they will go just by looking they would go crazy. And if I talk to them if I edit them or That was like layers of emotions and feelings added to that sensation. And then if I played with them, oh, that was another layer of sensation. And imagine at the end of all those, if I offer a treat, that would be like the icing on the cake, right? Yeah. But most of the time, I didn’t need to, I didn’t need to use treats. And one of the problems I think with in our dog industry is, it is a common problem with, I would say, with all industries. But in dog training industry, food companies, dog food companies have created this marketing tactic that, Hey, you want to trade train your dog treats by our treats. That’s the only way you can train your dog.
Angela
I’m a sucker for it.
Saro
And they’ve done a great job of marketing that, you know, people don’t want us the first thing that they think about anything about dogs. If you ask a dog owner, what is the first thing that comes in mind, they say treats. Treat my dog. I’m
Angela
an I’m a dog photographer, I have a shirt that says act on it. And act stands for always carry treats. Because dogs will do what I need them to do for my photos to get treats. But I’m not in their lives for very long. I have to use whatever tools I can, right. Yes, but it’s different. For the pet guardian, right?
Saro
Wow. Yeah, I say don’t use treats and food as your main purpose and tool as your dog training. Right? You know, dog training is different than you want a quick show, you know, a picture of a dog, for example. By the way, I again, I remember, I used to take my ad to doggy daycare. And I came across a photographer, it was my dog photographer, wedding photographer, he was one of my clients, she said, you know, we should take some pictures. That’s great idea. I’ll bring some dogs to your studio, and we’ll take a picture. We’ll take some pictures. And she goes, That’s a great idea. So I said, I’ll bring six dogs. So the photographer said, you know, I’m gonna book half a day. So we have enough time to work with all these dogs to take these pictures. So I took six dogs with me to the studio. And she said, Okay, let’s get started. So I told the dog to sit, I have the picture. I told the dog sit and lie down and I sat beside sat beside them. And we took many shots out of that. And then she said, Okay, that just took two minutes. Okay, it’s let’s take a picture of each one of them. So we took picture of each one of them, and took another five minutes or so. And we weren’t done within 10 minutes we were done.
Angela
Oh, trust me, it is so much easier to work with a well trained dog than it is with a non well trained dog. But they’re all fun for me. I don’t have to take them homes.
Saro
Right. Yeah, that’s the challenge. Also, here’s the other side of the challenge. For example, because the dog owners have used so much treat that the dog and the dog owner are so dependent on treats that when it comes to a simple task of sitting to take a photo, for example for you, becomes a big challenge. Because then the dog can’t do anything without treats or food being present. Right? is so dependent on everything on trade to do anything. And that’s the unfortunate part of you know, using treats to train dogs.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah,
Saro
it’s so dependent. But
Angela
sorrow let’s face it, we live in a world where we seek out convenience. We seek out the easy route, right? And so that’s where traits come into play. It can make it easier. That’s where I have no doubt I would never touch these items I would not but I have no doubt that that is where prawn collars, shock collars, etcetera, etcetera come into play. Are we doing harm to our dog companions by using these methods?
Saro
Yeah, we do we are, again, depending on tools and gadgets that are not necessary. Are there? Yes, they are quick fixes, but they don’t fix the core issues. Right. So what it does, it’s a band aid solutions, all of them, right? In general, if you’re depending on any tool or anything, any gadget, you’re limiting yourself, and you’re thinking, Okay, I’m gonna get good results, fast results. But which one do you prefer to have? Do you want to have a fast result? And a dog who’s messed up or longer working with a dog and having a lot last life, time lasting results? So that’s one of the problems for example, that I’ve noticed as a dog trainer for over 20 years is, every dog has reactivity, every dog has problems. And all of these dogs have been trained with treat, or tools or gadgets. Right? And what does that tell you that there is a problem with the system of dog training? Yeah, right. If you can’t, if you can control your dog, without depending on anything, that there’s something wrong. Yeah.
Angela
Now I grew up around labs, very beautiful breeds, right? The ones that will do things to please you. I got myself a big girl dog. And he was a Miranda sheepdog, a livestock Guardian dog. And everything I had learned about dogs, I had to throw it out the window. Because they are a completely different kind of genre of dog. They’re very stubborn. They’re very independent. I’m probably telling you things you already know. How does the how does the principle of no fear no aversion, no treats apply to the different kinds of dogs and their different personality traits, especially with these types of breeds that have independent traits bred throughout millennia?
Saro
Yes, good question. That the one thing that we have to accept and understand that all dogs have been bred for a purpose, or a reason? Yeah. And all dogs have been bred and designed by humans. For humans, there’s a reason why we breed them. Right? We wouldn’t breed crap, right? We would breed some dogs that they are actually manageable. Dogs that are well behaved dogs. Realistically breeding, a good breeder would breed a good breed of the dog that is breeding. Because everything is looking good, the fire is the same. The Healthy is the same behavior is the same and then let’s breed this dog right whatever breed it is, right? So breeders, their breeding good dogs, and all dogs are bred for a reason. Let’s say Blab, or Ozzy has been bred for so called hurting or helping with farm activities. That shoe also has been bred for a reason to to be a companion to be alarming, alarming, you know little dog that can be put anywhere to alarm intruder. So there’s a purpose for all of the dogs. In my opinion all dogs are working breeds. When you have a working breed is already comes prepackaged. Automatically. Who please humans. Yeah, it’s already most of the job has been done for you as a dog owner. All you have to do is gloss on this and cherish this breed drive or whatever it is in that dog and use it and as a dog owner as a dog lover, you have to select the right dog for your needs, right for your whatever your purposes are alike. So if you’re if you’re live, if you’re working 10 hours a day, and you have the weekend, just go and do some shopping and do house work and maybe just go to the local activities do little bit of this and that and you live on 10th floor apartment building, obviously, it’s not a good choice to make go and get an AWS. Right, right. And then what happened is happens is, the problem is people have the freedom to go and make decisions like that. So they go on, get a Ozzie living apartment work 10 hours a day, they don’t have time to devote to this dog. And then they say, oh, there’s something wrong with this dog. So I gotta fix it quickly. So they start reusing treats and tools and gadgets, and this and that. Where they don’t understand that first of all, this dog doesn’t belong in the family, unfortunately. Right? They made the wrong choice. But again, let’s say you made that choice and you have a nosy, you have to understand that. You can’t rely on tools and gadgets to solve your problem. You have to again, why did you choose a border collie? analogy to live with you? You liked the looks? You liked the way it walks the way it looks at you? Yes. Okay, you like those? But do you provide these dogs needs. You’re providing your needs, but you’re not providing the dog’s needs. And, and when the dog is not getting its needs, provided, then it becomes a problem. And then you say, You know what, I gotta solve this problem, I get it by shot caller asked by a Halti How to Use treats and this and that to solve this problem. Now it’s not working because because it’s not the reason it doesn’t work. Because you’re depending on tools and gadgets that are not supposed to be there in the first place. It’s not natural for a dog to wear a halting. It’s not natural for a dog to sit and we give treats. That’s not a natural behavior. Right. And when you do on natural things, you’re going against nature, and you’re causing a lot more deeper problems. Is that making sense? Yeah,
Angela
completely. And I’m assuming that the the sheer act of of praising our dogs, rewarding them with scratches and belly rubs instead of treats. helps to build the connection.
Saro
That’s all you need, actually,
Unknown Speaker
yeah,
Saro
once you build the connection, boom, you’re done.
Angela
Got it in the bag after that.
Saro
I mean, the easiest thing to say to a dog owner is if you want to train your dog, and if you want your dog to listen to you, we have the connection. You don’t have a connection, you just because that dog lives in your life in your home, and you feed it and you take it for a little walk, it doesn’t mean that you have a connection with that dog. That dog is just a roommate. Yeah. Connection is when a dog looks at you and says, You know what, you are my everything. You’re the most valuable thing in my life. I don’t care about that dog. I don’t care about that human. I don’t care about whatever is happening over there. You are my center of life. My You are my everything. Again, remember, dogs have been bred and designed for humans, by humans. And they will do anything for their humans. Once you have that connection, once you have that bond. Once you have that. You don’t have to ask your dog to stay with you. It will stay automatically. Once you have that connection. You don’t have to say come anymore, because it’s right there. Yeah, beside you.
Angela
And it’s really a magical thing too, isn’t it? Exactly.
Saro
Yes. And that’s the whole our hardest part for dog owners to develop the connection, deep connection. They say, Robert here, treats treats. Do you see it’s coming to me and listening to me and I’m giving the calf so happy this I’m giving treats and all that. But is the dog coming to you or to the tree? Well,
Angela
you know, if my husband just fed me ice cream, every few minutes, I’d probably start listening to him.
Saro
Yeah, but after a while, also, you’ll get bored of ice cream, you’re gonna say okay, life is more than ice cream.
Angela
I don’t know about that. And this heat, but whatever.
Saro
But life is more than food. Again, you know, let me differentiate the idea between food motivated and not food motivated. Yeah, there are three types of dogs in in human mind, food motivated, not food motivated. And dogs who are kind of in between food or not food. Food motivation is not that the dog is food motivated. food motivated means that the dog loves food. It just every living creature needs and loves food. Like labs. Exactly. Like legal. The funny thing is any dog that I your listener has, it says the same thing. Like it’s a normal natural behavior to be, you know, loving food. Yeah. Like for example, I love food too. But I don’t give up my life for food. I don’t know. There’s a saying. dogs live dogs live to feed to eat. There are people who are they love to eat to live or love to eat. You know what I mean? Yeah, there’s a difference. There.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, yeah, I gotcha.
Saro
Dogs are like that, too. There are certain dogs that they love to eat. There are certain dogs that they live to the for example, while Dan was the lifter they don’t constantly think about food. They only eat when they’re hungry. They say oh, it’s been four days. I haven’t eaten something. I gotta go and hunt and eat something. Right? And once they eat, you know, a tiger wants to it’s fed, you know, a giraffe dissolve can come pass by they don’t care. They don’t see it as a food. Right? Right.
Angela
No Shep Shep. Shep was a grazer. You know, I could leave him with a full bowl. And he would just pass by take a bun taken take a munch go on and you know, just ate whenever he wanted to. I thought that because Bella was the exact same breed. I could do the exact same thing with her. No. No, you put a bowl down in front of that girl and it is gone. Yes.
Saro
Yeah, yeah, that’s the thing. So I would say again, dogs are food motivated. But again, they’re not food motivated for training. Training is not just to teach the dog to sit, stay calm and all those it’s training is having that opportunity to really connect with the dog. Like, you know, when I say connect with the dog, the dog or train the dog, the dog owner thinks of it. Again, like treats. I got my porch for the treats and have let me see do I have time to train my dog? No, I’m busy. I gotta go get this. I gotta go get this done. No, I don’t have time today. Maybe tomorrow and tomorrow becomes next day. And so we don’t spend enough quality time with our dogs training is not to teach the dog to sit and stay. It’s to spend that time. So one of the biggest things that I teach dog owners is thinking about your dog as your zen moment that you say you know what, I am overwhelmed with my life and everything that is going on in my life. I’m going to devote half an hour an hour just to hang out with my dog. Just do nothing. And if you ask a dog owner to do nothing, they will say what do you mean do nothing I can’t be not doing nothing, I gotta do something. And the hardest part for any new man in general is not doing anything. It’s so true. Right? You can’t do anything, then your dog is saying this is a moving stress or can’t relax this human is just go go go all the time mentally, physically just going, going, going going, I can relax with this human. So therefore they don’t bond with you. They don’t connect with you. Wow, yeah. Because you say, you know, I don’t have time energy to sit down and do nothing with my dog. If you don’t have time to do nothing with your dog, and just Zen with your dog to sit them? Is it okay? If I put on TV and watch TV while my dog is on my lap? No, that’s not okay. That’s you’re faking it. You’re pretending to be physically there. But emotionally, mentally, you’re somewhere else. You want to be present with your dog. And if you do that, your dog is gonna say, Wow, this sorrow he, this human to actually hear with me is paying attention to me. Now I can walk with this human. Now I can make connections with this human because now I see that this human is valuing me first of all, and second of all, there is an opportunity for me to actually connect. And that connection happens without treats or food. Yeah. And once you have that connection, boom, everything is done.
Angela
So you’ve written a book called A Dog’s five essential needs? Can you share what some of the needs are?
Saro
Yeah. So many, many years ago, I was going and doing private training with, with my clients. And every time I was going to their home, I had to say the same thing. So I thought, Okay, I’m repeating myself. So I’m gonna write a book about it, and give this book to my clients. Right? So basically, when it comes to dogs, as a dog owner, you know, we have many needs, we have, we need our coffee, we need our computer, we need our cars, we need our wine, glasses, wine, we need our hitters we need we need our we need our phone, we need our best dad that that in order for us to say, You know what, I’m happy, I have a good life. I’m okay. Like, I’m well taken care of. Right. As a human, we need hundreds of things in order to be happy for a day. But for a dog, because dogs live in the moment, they have five things that they need per day. moment that that moment they need all this, which are exercise, training, socialization, care, and also affection. So exercise is something that you know, physically and physically they have to move, they have to have that opportunity to physically satisfy themselves. I call them stimulate themselves. All of these five things are stimulations. So physically, they need to stimulate themselves. They need to run, walk, physically get active, do something physical that brings the heart rate up. That’s natural for them. Most dogs, most breeds, that’s what they want to do. They want to run around, great home can run for 10 minutes and done. Whereas a border collie you can run for an hour and they’re saying okay, what’s next? Right, so depending on breed, but they need some form of physical stimulation, exercise, training is a mental stimulation where the dog says, I’m mentally focusing on something. And we don’t give opportunities for dogs to mentally focus on something because again, all day long, we’re going around doing something AD AD, you know, most of the dog owners will call me to go to help them. They have similar problems. And also their lifestyle is the same so I go to their home for behalf booked a session for dog training an hour at three o’clock for example. And I go there and the kids are running in the background. The husband is saying where is this? Where is that and we can handyman focus for an hour to do training. Right? And that’s the life that that dog is living. Right? It’s always go, go go, they can fit mentally can focus on anything. So training brings that mentality, the mental stimulation that they need to focus on something. And I suggest to focus on training, training the dog, you know, set stay Yes, calm and all that nice walk. So you’re in the investing a little bit of mental stimulation, mental activity in your dark, which in return gives you the results that you want as well. Training, right? Well trained dog training is a mental stimulation. Next, socialization is social stimulation. Dogs are social animals, they need to be stimulated socially as well. They love humans, they love dogs, they love cats, they love everything. The problem is that we don’t do proper socialization when they’re young, due to either bad breeding, they’re not knowing what you’re supposed to do, for example, the vet, they suggest not to socialize your dog until they’re fully vaccinated. That’s the big mistake, one of the biggest mistakes in dog training. And most people, they wait until the dog is five, six months old after the shots are done, but fully vaccinated. And then they start socializing, which is very late. Gotta start really early. And overall, dogs are social animals, they need to be socializing with everything, they enjoyed us social stimulation, you know, again, it’s a stimulation and dogs are bred and designed for humans by humans, and because we want them to socialize with everything to be okay. Right. And next thing is care care is you know, taking care of the dog, you know, feeding the dog, brushing the dog, you know, checking, making sure the health is all good shape. I don’t have to teach most dog owners how to care for their dogs, but that’s the 1514. And the last thing a dog needs is affection. Affection. So care is a physiological stimulation. Affection is emotional stimulation. Dogs need emotional stimulation as well. And as you can see, that’s the fifth thing a dog needs affection. But most dog owners they focus on either exercise training, socialization, and you ignore those and they just focus on affection, or share affection with this dog. Right? So affection becomes, in my opinion, a tool as a reward. Okay, you tell a dog. I love you. Good girl. Good boy. Yes. And that dog says, Wow, this human is praising me. He’s loving me. Sharing affection with me. That’s the best reward for a dog. Yeah. which lasts long. And that’s the fifth thing a dog owner needs to share with the dog exercise, training, socialization care should be first and then affection the last. So that’s what basically it is. The book goes in more depth in details about you know, all these needs. But that’s the basically what a dog owner should focus on. Today, I have to provide these five things for my dog, no matter what breed it is, no matter what age it is, no matter what the situation is. Or have a overweight dog. I can exercise. Yes, it still needs exercise. Or have a small dog. Yes, still needs exercise, training, socialization, you provide all these, then you’re not looking for Band Aid solutions. In life for dogs are simple. That’s all they need. You know, on daily basis, you provide those five things the dog says, I’m good. I had my exercise. I had my mental stimulation training, which I spent good time with my human. I had my socialization I saw the neighbor’s cat was so cute. It was so funny. I said hi to it. I had my breakfast and also dinner. And I my mom, my dad and my family shared so much affection with me today. I’m good. Yeah, I mean peace with my Life, I don’t have to react, I don’t have to care about anything. I’m just
Angela
so that simple. It is
Saro
simple. I say usually this, this philosophy should apply to humans to two husbands, two wives, two kids. If you simplify life, right, it becomes easier to manage. Right? When we have too many things in our to do list, then we start stressing, right? If you’re looking for this, and that, and that, then we are investing time and energy to satisfy us to get to this and that, and that. If we just focus on, you know, simple life with our dogs, and simple life, in general, with our families and ourselves, then we have more time to enjoy the dogs. And actually, the dogs would love to spend more time with us real time, not just fun on one of those fake times, you know, sitting watching TV, pretending that I’m spending time with my dog, No, you go for a walk with your dog, you go in the yard and play with your dog for no reason as a kid, just like you were a kid. You play with no, when you were a kid, you had no worries in your mind. You were you’re all in matter was having fun. Become a kid and go and play with your dog with that mindset and say, You know what I’m going to be in a Zen with my dog for half an hour a day. You invest that you’re going to get rid of treats, aversive tools, aversive methods, diversity of ideas in your life. Right, you’re going to start learning that, like dog training is so simple. It it has nothing to do with sit stays calm and obedience and agility and this and that. It has to do with you fixing your life. So you can help your dog so your dog can help you back.
Angela
Which ties back to what you said earlier about how you are as much a life coach of humans. As you are a trainer of dogs. It’s
Saro
not yes. And I’m not saying I’m a perfect person myself, but based on my experiences, I’m working with dog owners. I have become, you know, most of the time when I used to go to dog owners home wife and husband. It ended up being a consultation for the marriage, I became a marriage consult. Funny. We were not talking about the dog anymore. We were talking about them. Because her husband was saying, Oh, it’s hurtful. She was saying it’s his fault. Because of the dog is came in, she wanted the dog. I didn’t want the dog and this happened. And that happened. And this happened. And that happened. I’m blaming her she’s blaming me not to see that what’s happened. It became like, the dog is like, what the hell is going on? What
Angela
am I probably we’re to you’re sitting there with the dog going,
Saro
I don’t know. But like, I can help you, buddy. And that’s, that’s that’s how I became a coach because I realized that I’m not just working with dogs to help the dog. I’m helping these humans to figure out what to do with their life so they can figure out how to deal with the dog. So I had to study human psychology, learn about humans work with you. Because of my work with humans. I gained some information there some knowledge, there’s some ability to figure out how to deal with this aspect of my life, which is dogs and dogs. I’m not perfect in anything else. Right. I have learned how to deal with my own personal traumas as well. I grew up with trauma. I learned that trauma was a big part of my life. It’s a big part of everybody’s life. Everybody goes through trauma, and how to deal with it and the impacts that it has in our lives is so profound and so deep that a dark can help to realize those moments and help us to fix those moments. that are making us not to move forward with our lives. And I learned it the hard way, I learned it, how to deal with it. I put away all my traumas, I’m free all of it. I know how to control it, how to manage it, not because I’m a perfect person, because of my doubts. Yeah. They helped me to become the person who I am to date that I can help others. Right. And that’s the beauty of dogs. And if we get too deep, if you learn to get a little bit deeper about our relationship with our dogs, rather than just, oh, it’s a good dog, it sits on my lap, and you know, it wags its tail once in a while. Rather than just being that it becomes a more deeper I would say life and relationship with dogs.
Angela
We talked a bit about it off camera. You brought it up before I did, that dogs can be our greatest teachers, if we allow them to be how do we use our non tree based non aversive training to allow ourselves to open up to what our dogs have to teach us?
Saro
Yeah. So when, when we say You know, we have a dog, it’s not something that it’s not an object, it has all these feelings and emotions, and they can, you know, they can support us in many ways they can help us to do realize that there is a problem in our lives, they can also cause more problems in our lives. They are projecting exactly what we are distributing to our universe, if if you have a messy life, if our chaos life, they will be reacting to that, and they will show you the chaos that you deserve. You know, so let’s say it again, I’ll give you an example of a family that, you know, it’s all go go go kids are running around in the house, they had, I’ll give you an example. The other example, I had a shop and you know, either doggy daycare, or we had a shop in front, we had all kinds of displays and products and stuff like that. And there was this lady came with her kids, two kids. Regarding dogs and dog training and dog daycare, we’re talking about that. And these two kids are we have a freezer, we have a display table, these kids are jumping freezers and displays and chaos is happening in my shop. Sounds like a nightmare. And I’m listening to her but in my background, I’m saying what the hell is going on? There’s a chaos in my shop. And I got to do something about this. So I tell the owner, can you end the dog is just jumping and running all over the place as well. I’m saying can you ask your kids to not to jump on things? Can Can they come and stay here? Their kids? They’re doing kids stuff? She says? No. I’m saying okay, you’re projecting the same idea to your dog as well. And you’re affecting me. Right? This is a small example of our society. Yeah, what is happening, right? You, as a dog owner, as a human, you can’t even control your kids. Obviously, you won’t be able to control your dog. And you want peace and quiet. You want the dog to stop doing certain things. And that’s the way it is our in our lives. And the dog that says this house is chaos. I’m going to join this chaos. And I’m going to do my best to ruin this family. So they will realize that there’s something wrong with them. So they will go and ask sorrow to help at least, like for example, a dog is not biting somebody to piss you off. It’s a release of a tension. It’s a release of stress that this dog has felt for years and years and says, You know what? I’ve been telling this dog owner, my dog owner, Mike Newman, that I’m stressed. For many years I’ve been telling you and Dumbo owners, they don’t see it. They don’t feel it. So Dog says, What can I do to make this clear to this human that I need help? So I’m going to bite, I’m going to bark. I’m going to eat something, I’m going to chew this. Actually, you know, they’re physically. No. Visually, they’re telling us I need help. And why is it that that dog need helps needs help? Is it because maybe your life is in chaos? And you haven’t been able to help this dog? Because you can even help your own life? A blind can’t help a blind, right? Right. So most dog owners, they have chaos in their lives, and they’re trying to say, I’m gonna go and rescue a dog. To help a dog. I mean, you can’t even help yourself yet, you haven’t got to that point that you are imperfect life and you want to help other stuff. Others? And then they go on to rescue a dog or get a dog and the dog says, Okay, you need help. Right? And what can I do to help you? Okay, I’m gonna do this and that, and that. Hopefully, you get the message. So that’s why I’m saying dogs come in our lives for a reason. Because I use them as a tool, let’s call them a tool are helping us to gauge our lives? Where are where we are at our lives? Are we in peace? Or are we in chaos? Right? So
Angela
what comes to mind is the cliche that you don’t get the dog you want, you get the dog you need. Yeah. And they really show us not just who we need to be, but who we can be. Mm hmm. Right?
Saro
Yes. That’s very true in this day and age, especially with all this chaos that is going around the world. And, you know, human history has been, you know, getting more and more chaotic. You know,
Angela
I live in the United States, you don’t have to tell me.
Saro
very chaotic in Canada to even I think I would say it’s kind of worse than us now have to, oh, boy, at least you have a light at the end of the tunnel. I know kinda. But we are we are stuck with our Hello. But but you’re chaotic. Our lives has been more more and more become more chaotic. In the past. Dog owners, they didn’t need to hire a dog trainer. There was no need of dog training. I live. I live in a in us in the suburbs of British Columbia. There are farms and farmers and all that. And I go and talk to Doug, these farmers. And I’m saying, Yeah, I’m a doctor, because he’s doctrine. Why people need doctrine and my dog is trained. Right? It does exactly what I want it to do. It naturally automatically been trained, because their life is different. And, and the government comes and says, You know what farmer farmer, we’re going to, we’re going to modernize your farm. And we’re going to do this and that and the farmer says, I don’t need those. I know how to raise a cow. I know how to grow things. And you don’t need to come and tell me how to do it. And modernize my life, which I don’t need, which is going to bring more chaos in my life. I just need my time to raise my cows and sell my meat to farm in farmer’s market. That’s all I want to do. You know, simple life, but we make it chaotic for others and ourselves in a way. So in the past, we didn’t need dog trainers. Right? dogs were bred and for humans by humans and they were doing exactly what we needed to do a doberman. The reason why we bred Doberman, for example, was to protect protect the taxman. Yeah, but you know, the taxman was going and collecting tax from people’s home and they were carrying a lot of money with them. They were collecting money and they were getting robbed. So they needed a solution. So they said, you know, what, are we going to breed this scary dog that no one is going to dare to. Approach? Yeah, they bred Doberman and the taxman would take it around. And then you know, collect the money. Every breed has a history. You know? Why? Why did we bred beagles because we needed a dog that could go and find a game. And you know, when we should the game, the game falls somewhere we need to go and find it somewhere and the Beagle goes and finds it barks and let us know where exactly it is. And the tail, the white part at the end of the tail is to distinguish visually for us where it is, and tell all the way stands straight up, and the tip of the tail is white. So we can distinguish where it is. So we can go and grew up with all of the breeds have a purpose other reason, and that’s how naturally they were bred. Now nowadays, we are over breeding them, crop breeding them, making pugs that have flat face, they can’t breed, things like that. But originally, every dog had a purpose or the reason why they were there. The dog owner wouldn’t treat them it would live with them in the house. Feed them exactly what they were feeding eating. They were feed them the scrap the leftovers to the dog. The dog was getting exercise training, socialization, care and affection naturally, all day long. It would stay with them live with them. Life was good. Right? Modern era has created more problems, more issues. And again, we are looking for Band Aid solutions. where that’s not natural, not not normal. And when you approach anything on naturally you get negative results.
Angela
As a photographer, I don’t have a studio, I tell people that Mother Nature couldn’t possibly be a studio environment. She is the greatest studio ever created. And that’s why I love taking dogs to do dog things and Mother Nature’s creation but is the dog her best creation ever. It’s
Saro
an it’s the dog is in its natural settings. And it’s the best studio.
Angela
But is it is the dog her greatest creation.
Saro
It’s one of them. One of them? You know, I mean, I always tell dog owners it’s so we are so lucky to have to, to have the opportunity to have dogs in our lives. Yeah, we are. You know, and if you I encourage everybody to have dogs. Because if you understand the purpose of having a dog then you say the more I have, the better it is. So bringing back to the your first the first segment that you’re saying the owner had five beagles. You know, I mean, they’re amazing dogs. First of all, all dogs are amazing. All breeds are amazing. But having a beagle, you know, I if I could, I would have 510 B dogs as well. Right? Realistically, I would have some people have the opportunity to have more than one or two dogs. And that’s great. Because you know what it does? It gives you more opportunities to become a better human. Yeah. Right. And I always say, if if you if you are able to help your dog to live its fullest life, then you have made your life, the best life. Therefore you can now help your family and then you can help your community then you can help your society and your country. Right, it starts small, but it impacts if you can change a dog’s life to the fullest, then you have you can you have achieved your highest level of being as a human being because you’ve been able to impact of dogs and living things. Life and then when you change that you impact that you’re saying, Wow, what have I done? I’m amazing. I should help others too. I should have more dogs. Right. That’s how I look at it. I mean, again, I see dogs as a sore I have energy information that can impact our lives. And we are so lucky to have the opportunity to have dogs. Not wolves, not elephants, but dogs in our lives that are so different animals than any other animal. But they’re different than cats. For sure.
And I’ve never seen a dog owner that says, You know what? Yeah, they would say I had the worst dog in the world, but I love love.
Angela
Narrow do you do training online?
Saro
Yes, at the moment, I just at this stage of my life, I’m just doing online. I do online only online? Because I need to get deep like this. And with one on one, first of all, sessions in person, there is this. There is this limitations? Like one on one. So I paid you Come on, give me results. I need results. And we can get results again, with a bandaid. You know, you got to get deep, right. And the only way that we can get deep is if you work with me online, one on one, I have students from all over the worlds board that, you know, they have the same problems in France, they have the same problem they have in Canada, in us in Germany, they all have the same problems. So I can help everybody, right? And that gives us the opportunity to go deep. And when we go deep, not only you’re changing your life again, you’re changing your dog’s life. You’re changing
Speaker 1
the society. Yeah, that’s awesome. Yeah. So
Saro
we do online, I used to do offline. I mean, you know, in person and group classes and one on ones. And then the pandemic happened. And then we had to go online forcefully. And then I realized, Oh, I’m working with dollars online, I’m getting better results online than in person. Because in person, you know, the dog reacts to me, either wants to kill me, or wants to hang out with me and have fun with me. Right? So that effects the training, right. And then when we are in group session, there are six or seven other dogs, they will either want to kill each other, or they want to play with each other. And the dog owner is like, what am I supposed to do? What am I and I’m here, help me sorrow. And I’m saying I can help you in this setting is too much for me. And you? Yeah. But when we are in home selling, you’re sitting at your home and your dog is right there. And I’m telling you do this and do that there’s no distractions and you’re perfecting your techniques. And once you perfect your technique and your mindset, boom, you’re done. Yes.
Angela
So where do we find you online? Online,
Saro
you can find sorrow dog training.com It’s my name and dog training sorrow dog. training.com. Everything is there. I have a YouTube channel as well. Sorrow dog training at sorrow dog training on YouTube. Lots of videos and content about all these things that we talked about. And you know, technically training dogs and mindset and all that. I do weekly, bi weekly live sessions on YouTube as well as equations and how I deal with public related question. So yeah, my website is the best source of contracting.
Angela
Awesome, sir. Thank you so much for joining us today. I enjoyed this conversation so much.
Saro
Thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to share this information with your tribe, your members. Yeah. And as well as sharing with others, and I appreciate every dog owner that takes the time to talk about dogs. I love talking about dogs.
Angela
I could talk about them all day. Yes.
Saro
But what I’ve been meant for to do in my life, I think and that’s again because my first dog helped me to spark it sparked the idea in my mind and helped me to get to where I am today. Again, thanks to dogs and thanks to my dog, Jonah.
Angela
So beautiful